Meeting Notes 2011 09 13

From Noisebridge
(Difference between revisions)
Jump to: navigation, search
(Discussion Items)
 
(2 intermediate revisions by 2 users not shown)
Line 108: Line 108:
  
 
Leif feels like talking to him would be the right thing to do.
 
Leif feels like talking to him would be the right thing to do.
 
The consensus is that the consensus be postponed.
 
  
 
It seems like the best moment to put this process through would be after the suspension, otherwise consensus may be difficult to achieve. (AKA RUBIN BLOCKS)
 
It seems like the best moment to put this process through would be after the suspension, otherwise consensus may be difficult to achieve. (AKA RUBIN BLOCKS)
  
 +
The consensus is that the consensus be postponed until the month's suspension is up.
 
---
 
---
  
Getting more t-shirts. $1500 approx is allotted. Request for red shirts for trek victims, also women's sizes. Also wearable bikesheds and embroided ... I don't know, Swiss national dress?  
+
Getting more t-shirts. $1500 approx is allotted. Request for red shirts for trek victims, also women's sizes. Also wearable bikesheds and embroidered ... I don't know, Swiss national dress?  
  
(TODO put that in the LOG)
+
"Shall Noisebridge order and pay $1500 for t-shirts." is proposed for consensus.
 
+
"Shall Noisebridge order and pay $1500 for t-shirts."
+
 
+
---
+
 
+
"Noisebridge shall pay the funds up to $700 measuring device, after a collection has been made."
+
  
 
=== Discussion Items ===
 
=== Discussion Items ===
Line 129: Line 122:
 
Ben K would like to talk about lighting.
 
Ben K would like to talk about lighting.
  
I've heard rumours, made measurements, COLLECTED FACTS, while we have the lights turned on, we have 2.5KW per hour. Approx 1/3rd of our power bill, cost hundreds of dollars a month (our last bill was c. $833). Also burned out lights that are drawing power.
+
I've heard rumors, made measurements, COLLECTED FACTS, while we have the lights turned on, we are drawing 2.5KW per hour. That's pprox 1/3rd of our power bill, costs hundreds of dollars a month (our last bill was c. $833). Also burned out lights that are drawing power.
  
 
We don't know what is using all the energy. So phase 1 of Operation DESTRUCTO-ENERGY is
 
We don't know what is using all the energy. So phase 1 of Operation DESTRUCTO-ENERGY is
  
* Measuring. Put one measurement device on one of our feeds, and Ben would like to spend NB money on a second device that works on the second feed. $700 will meter the whole place.
+
* Measuring. Put one measurement device on one of our feeds, already. Ben would like to spend NB money on a second device that works on the second feed. $700 will meter the whole place.
  
* Once we have metering, the SF dept of environment who will come out, and audit what we are using for electricity with the hope that they can get us funding from PG&E to improve the situation. They have explicitly are NOT part of building inspection, they  want to reduce our energy usage. What we have moderately inefficient lighting, but it can be significantly improved for a sum of money -- we have no idea of the costs. But that's the point of the inspection. They write down what we have, so that they can prove we aren't lying when we ask for the money. We have a whole pile of spares and a whole pile of dead lights, which Jim and Ben will be fixing together before the inspector comes in next week or so (appointment has not yet been scheduled).
+
* Once we have metering, the SF dept of environment who will come out, and audit what we are using for electricity with the hope that they can get us funding from PG&E to improve the situation. They have explicitly are NOT part of building inspection, they  want to reduce our energy usage only. We have moderately inefficient lighting, but it can be significantly improved for a sum of money -- we have no idea of the costs. But that's the point of the inspection. They write down what we have, so that they can prove we aren't lying when we ask for the money from PG&E. We have a whole pile of spares and a whole pile of dead lights, which Jim and Ben will be fixing together before the inspector comes in next week or so (appointment has not yet been scheduled).
  
 
Wish asked about solar panels. Ben says we would need more money than we have -- it would take 10-15 years to recoup the costs. We could drop our powerbill by a third.
 
Wish asked about solar panels. Ben says we would need more money than we have -- it would take 10-15 years to recoup the costs. We could drop our powerbill by a third.
Line 148: Line 141:
 
mess, and that's why we get two measurements.
 
mess, and that's why we get two measurements.
  
----
+
It was agreed to fund-raise for the $700, and for a consensus item to be placed next week to draw the remainder from NB funds.
 +
 
 +
"Noisebridge shall pay the funds up to $700 measuring device, after a collection has been made."
 +
is put up for consensus.
  
 
Danny would like to talk about what happened with Rob 2.0's rack, and do-but-notify
 
Danny would like to talk about what happened with Rob 2.0's rack, and do-but-notify
Line 154: Line 150:
 
Pass the donation box for a second projector (for Church)
 
Pass the donation box for a second projector (for Church)
  
 +
Rubin says:
 
When we did the revamp of the infrastructure, when the rack was set up, it was
 
When we did the revamp of the infrastructure, when the rack was set up, it was
 
a rat's nest, with cables hanging out. I thought it was a danger. When I
 
a rat's nest, with cables hanging out. I thought it was a danger. When I
Line 162: Line 159:
 
we stated that we didn't want the place turning into a hosting facility. People
 
we stated that we didn't want the place turning into a hosting facility. People
 
put in machines, they don't tell anyone, noone leave any notes. It's a pain.
 
put in machines, they don't tell anyone, noone leave any notes. It's a pain.
Noisebridge money goes into the power and the internet.
+
Noisebridge money goes into paying for the power and the internet.
  
The rack was holding it together, nothing was powering on, there was a melted
+
The rack in question was barely holding together, nothing was powering on, there was a melted
laptop. So I decided to move it out from the sidetalk.  It didn't seem to be
+
laptop. So I decided to move it out to the sidetalk.  It didn't seem to be
doing anything useful. And in the spirit of noisebridge, I felt I was hacking
+
doing anything useful, and was in the way of the fire escape. And in the spirit of noisebridge, I felt I was hacking
 
the space, by removing the rack.
 
the space, by removing the rack.
  
 
There was a 2U which was missing everything but its motherboard, but wasn't
 
There was a 2U which was missing everything but its motherboard, but wasn't
really assembled together. It seemed like somebody's trash. There was four
+
really assembled together. There was four powerstrips and ethernet tied to the machine; both were dangerously looped over the rest of the sapce.  
powerstrips and ethernet tied to the machine.  
+
  
 
Jorgen said when Rob came in he asked about his servers. Rubin said
 
Jorgen said when Rob came in he asked about his servers. Rubin said
that they really didn't seem working servers. We re-iterated the rule that everything
+
that they really didn't seem working like servers.  
 +
 
 +
We re-iterated the rule that everything
 
that is deposited in the space is a donation, and membership shelves have no
 
that is deposited in the space is a donation, and membership shelves have no
 
guarantee.  
 
guarantee.  
  
Duncan points out having a name and number on an item can help stop it from
+
Duncan points out having a name and number on an item *can* help stop it from
 
being re-purposed.
 
being re-purposed.
  
Line 192: Line 190:
 
the negativity, I think there is their potential.  
 
the negativity, I think there is their potential.  
  
Rachel Hospodar was Rachel, Mitch, Miloh, Jake, Leila, Mike. He seemed like he
+
Rachel Hospodar said she was there last night to meet Rob 2.0 -- the people were Rachel, Mitch, Miloh, Jake, Leila, Mike. He seemed like he
 
wanted to be here, but he had a hard time accepting that he had to change. It's
 
wanted to be here, but he had a hard time accepting that he had to change. It's
 
not clear which way he has to go.
 
not clear which way he has to go.
  
 
Winn: here is another sort of really faulty psychological person. He's had a
 
Winn: here is another sort of really faulty psychological person. He's had a
hard life. He can win you over. In the meantime, he's on disability. He can be
+
hard life. He can win you over. He can be
 
disruptive. Everyplace I go, I can tell where he's been.
 
disruptive. Everyplace I go, I can tell where he's been.
  
A warning is more appropriate than throwing things out.
+
Rubin felt it was inappropriate to talk about Rob 2.0 without him being here to defend himself.
 +
 
 +
Danny felt that a warning was more appropriate than throwing things out.
  
 
Rachel Hospodar says that throwing stuff out like this without warning, is an
 
Rachel Hospodar says that throwing stuff out like this without warning, is an
Line 207: Line 207:
 
Evan says we have a reasonable expectation that the rack was not being used,
 
Evan says we have a reasonable expectation that the rack was not being used,
 
and ignored for a good period of time, and yes, it should be thrown out. A post
 
and ignored for a good period of time, and yes, it should be thrown out. A post
to the main mailing list about that would be useful.  
+
to the main mailing list about that, though, would be useful.  
  
Last night at 3AM, and we had a giant argument with Rob 2.0. We tried to
+
Last night at 3AM, Rachel says we had a giant argument with Rob 2.0. We tried to
 
convince him not to be an asshole. And then Rob's response was to explain the
 
convince him not to be an asshole. And then Rob's response was to explain the
reasoning behind that behaviour. I don't care the reason behind it, and now I
+
reasoning behind that behaviour. I don't care the reason behind it, I just care that he was an asshole, says Rachel, and now I
feel I'm having the same experience with you.
+
feel I'm having the same experience with you, Rubin.
  
It was harder, because we had to explain why Rubin is an asshole too, and why
+
It was harder to pursuade him to change his behaviour, because we had to explain why Rubin is an asshole too, and why
that's okay.  
+
that's sometimes okay.  
  
 
Someone says they hate Rubin. Someone says they love Rubin.
 
Someone says they hate Rubin. Someone says they love Rubin.
Line 230: Line 230:
 
point out, a discussion with Danny, when I first got here, I was rather feral.
 
point out, a discussion with Danny, when I first got here, I was rather feral.
 
The music went up, and I thought it was an excellent thing to pull the wire
 
The music went up, and I thought it was an excellent thing to pull the wire
out, and I sort of modelled that on behaviour that I'd seen. One thing to do:
+
out, and I sort of modelled that on behaviour that I'd seen in the space. One thing to do:
 
it might be mindful, with a broad spectrum of backgrounds, our behaviour will
 
it might be mindful, with a broad spectrum of backgrounds, our behaviour will
 
be modelled. It might be one thing to throw away a rack. Someone might do the
 
be modelled. It might be one thing to throw away a rack. Someone might do the
Line 236: Line 236:
 
error or doubt would be useful.
 
error or doubt would be useful.
  
He did leave the space voluntarily. He should get credit for that.
+
Someone notes that Rob 2.0 did leave the space voluntarily. He should get credit for that.
  
Jorgen thinks he may have ADD. He'll take the scooter, and be five minutes in
+
Jorgen believes he may have ADD. He'll take the scooter, and be five minutes in
 
the workshop, he'll take out eight screws, and then he'll wander off onto the
 
the workshop, he'll take out eight screws, and then he'll wander off onto the
 
computer. The thing that bothered me was the constant usage of community
 
computer. The thing that bothered me was the constant usage of community
 
computers.
 
computers.
  
One of the problems with Rob, is that he was sleeping here. I have a solution
+
One of the problems with Rob, is that he was sleeping here. Kayla says she has keys for a place for him to sleep.
for that, Kayla says she has keys for a place for him.
+
  
 
If you see Rob taking things apart, ask him if he is going to put things back together.
 
If you see Rob taking things apart, ask him if he is going to put things back together.
Line 254: Line 253:
 
Duncan: but I think he wants to change, and all of this didn't help.
 
Duncan: but I think he wants to change, and all of this didn't help.
  
As a fellow person with ADHD, part of it is you don't consider the consequences
+
Someone: As a fellow person with ADHD, part of it is you don't consider the consequences
of your actions. Executive functions aren't the greatest. You just have to form habits by restructuring things. Pretty much I think the best solution just to reiterate to Rob, if you see him doing.
+
of your actions. Executive functions aren't the greatest. You just have to form habits by restructuring things. Pretty much I think the best solution just to reiterate to Rob, to not do certain things, if you see him doing them.
  
 
Jorgen says he responds well with a good sense of humor.
 
Jorgen says he responds well with a good sense of humor.
  
Jorgen is a good point person to put in touch.
+
Everyone agreed Jorgen is a good point person to have as the contact person.
 
+
We agreed to let him help himself to the servers in the back classroom.
+
  
 +
We agreed to let Rob 2.0 help himself to the racks in the back classroom.
  
 
=== End of Meeting ===
 
=== End of Meeting ===

Latest revision as of 02:08, 14 September 2011

Contents

[edit] Agenda

The 178th Meeting of Noisebridge

Note-taker: User:Malaclyps

Moderator: User:Leif

[edit] Introduction and Names

  • What Noisebridge is about: "Noisebridge is a 501c3 nonprofit that provides a space for creation, collaboration, and learning about technology and creative projects. Noisebridge provides space, power tools, and infrastructure to help the public learn new skills and create cool things. Noisebridge continues to exist through and depends entirely on membership fees and donations. Our code of conduct is 'Be excellent to each other'."
  • Round of introductions: What's your name, what do you do, and if you are new, how did you hear about Noisebridge? Start with the moderator and go left.

Leif is moderating the meeting

Shaun-Simon -- first time at any hackerspace

Michael -- Applied Anthropologist hanging out to SPY ON THE PRIMATES, overwhelmed by the amount of activity going on

Mike -- a technowanderer

Jesse -- I'm a just into technology, projects apparently working on an arcade table to play classic arcade games

Elliot -- first time,

Drew -- just turned up this week, developer working on some UNDOUBTEDLY COOL projects

Danny -- I am taking notes

Wish -- Wish fulfilling tree is what it's short for. It's like bazillions of years ago, I was applied math/arch/engineering into classical Indian music, yoga, mathematical kind of science of consciousness raising with combined with the Gods and Maestros of India. Running for Mayor. Kind of hard word what with the MAN. Dad was an innovative open heart surgeon, and eccentric hacking part of my background.

Jorgen -- involved with Tastebridge, not running for mayor.

Evan -- been coming here for the last six months, generally been doing web dev.

Michel - I come from Paris, first time here. Hi!

Carl -- and I'm watching people mispelling my name.

Rob -- community plumber. Into web dev and STUFF.

Duncan -- is a friend to all

Leanne - jut want to learn how to cook, and hack, etc.

Alex -- herds electrons

Snail -- professional cat herder

Rubin -- I like to keep it


[edit] Short Announcements

Cool new projects? Something you'd like people to know? Say now, but keep it short!


[edit] New or Stale Events

Is there anything new happening at the space?

Is there anything that has stopped happening at the space?

Anyone interested in restarting the Ruby group?

It was more of a class thing, every Tuesday at 6pm and Robert was holding it, and he relocated to the downtown library, due to the crowds on Tuesday. Like to reboot it locally here. Maybe better more as a working group rather than a class, because everyone here has their own little projects.

According to Steve Dee, hopefully we start a preliminary meeting of deep hack, spelunking for the 21st century. A great need to rediscover what's under your fingertips. Understand what underlies all the technology we use. Project will be to see what's going on in a computer memory, using qemu to examine and modify its memory while it's running. Talk to Mike or Leif after the meeting.

Hacker Prom is going to be on October 1st. If you feel like helping, contact User:Rubin110 . We'll also have the Arse Electronika conference about technology and porn workshop the next day. The perfect prom chaser.

Dorkbot would like to host another event here, they weren't able to pull talkers together for this month. Looks like it'll be the 3rd week of October on Wednesday. Donations would go to us. Weeeee!

(TODO update the merging of Django class with Python class)

[edit] Financial Report

Funds in bank: pretty well, so legend has it.


[edit] Membership Binder

  • Read off any names from the binder for the past month. Write a check on every open application.
  • Anyone up for joining this week (ie have four checks by their name + have two sponsors) should introduce themselves then leave the area in search of gifts (traditionally beer and a lime) for the rest of the group. The rest of the meeting should consense on whether they may join.


Jorgen was consensed on 2011-09-13 and is now a member! Alex Paul was consensed on 2011-09-13 and is now a member!

[edit] Consensus items

Notification of the forthcoming consensus item, proposed by Jake:

To bar Jay from entering the space and participating in the community.

(See Current Consensus Items page.)

Rubin felt that it would be appropriate not to kick him while he's down. The problem may already have solved itself, so we shouldn't pre-emptively make a rule.

Wish says I just saw him as just as a huge potential problem because he has some serious emotional issues, and tends to drag people down. It stopped the whole process of Noisebridge. It seems unlikely that he would be re-cuperated after a month.

Rubin says he agrees, but we shouldn't do it until after a month. Right now, we don't have an issue.

Leif feels like talking to him would be the right thing to do.

It seems like the best moment to put this process through would be after the suspension, otherwise consensus may be difficult to achieve. (AKA RUBIN BLOCKS)

The consensus is that the consensus be postponed until the month's suspension is up. ---

Getting more t-shirts. $1500 approx is allotted. Request for red shirts for trek victims, also women's sizes. Also wearable bikesheds and embroidered ... I don't know, Swiss national dress?

"Shall Noisebridge order and pay $1500 for t-shirts." is proposed for consensus.

[edit] Discussion Items

Ben K would like to talk about lighting.

I've heard rumors, made measurements, COLLECTED FACTS, while we have the lights turned on, we are drawing 2.5KW per hour. That's pprox 1/3rd of our power bill, costs hundreds of dollars a month (our last bill was c. $833). Also burned out lights that are drawing power.

We don't know what is using all the energy. So phase 1 of Operation DESTRUCTO-ENERGY is

  • Measuring. Put one measurement device on one of our feeds, already. Ben would like to spend NB money on a second device that works on the second feed. $700 will meter the whole place.
  • Once we have metering, the SF dept of environment who will come out, and audit what we are using for electricity with the hope that they can get us funding from PG&E to improve the situation. They have explicitly are NOT part of building inspection, they want to reduce our energy usage only. We have moderately inefficient lighting, but it can be significantly improved for a sum of money -- we have no idea of the costs. But that's the point of the inspection. They write down what we have, so that they can prove we aren't lying when we ask for the money from PG&E. We have a whole pile of spares and a whole pile of dead lights, which Jim and Ben will be fixing together before the inspector comes in next week or so (appointment has not yet been scheduled).

Wish asked about solar panels. Ben says we would need more money than we have -- it would take 10-15 years to recoup the costs. We could drop our powerbill by a third.

We are taking 900Watts on the front panel, and no idea what it is.

We have one two-phase panel, and we have a standard three-phase commercial panel, one to the kitchen, one to the shop. And then a third one that Rubin just spotted.

Rubin explains how the two sweatshops were divided, so the electrics are a mess, and that's why we get two measurements.

It was agreed to fund-raise for the $700, and for a consensus item to be placed next week to draw the remainder from NB funds.

"Noisebridge shall pay the funds up to $700 measuring device, after a collection has been made." is put up for consensus.

Danny would like to talk about what happened with Rob 2.0's rack, and do-but-notify

Pass the donation box for a second projector (for Church)

Rubin says: When we did the revamp of the infrastructure, when the rack was set up, it was a rat's nest, with cables hanging out. I thought it was a danger. When I unplugged it, our internet stopped working. Some people thought that there was a MITM attack. Actually it turned out to be the closet, so we fixed that.

Last night, we were whittled down a lot of servers. When we first started NB, we stated that we didn't want the place turning into a hosting facility. People put in machines, they don't tell anyone, noone leave any notes. It's a pain. Noisebridge money goes into paying for the power and the internet.

The rack in question was barely holding together, nothing was powering on, there was a melted laptop. So I decided to move it out to the sidetalk. It didn't seem to be doing anything useful, and was in the way of the fire escape. And in the spirit of noisebridge, I felt I was hacking the space, by removing the rack.

There was a 2U which was missing everything but its motherboard, but wasn't really assembled together. There was four powerstrips and ethernet tied to the machine; both were dangerously looped over the rest of the sapce.

Jorgen said when Rob came in he asked about his servers. Rubin said that they really didn't seem working like servers.

We re-iterated the rule that everything that is deposited in the space is a donation, and membership shelves have no guarantee.

Duncan points out having a name and number on an item *can* help stop it from being re-purposed.

Mike talked about how Rob had messed with public resources, like the computer he used. A lot of the pictures of the build out were deleted, and Linux installed. He destroyed three really good scooters.

Mike screamed at him last night because he depended on that computer.

Rob 1.0 had to rush , but can relate to some of Rob's behaviours, because I'm a minor version of him. But I think are some good underlying qualities, and he has potential to be more valuable asset as a lot of people do. Despite all of the negativity, I think there is their potential.

Rachel Hospodar said she was there last night to meet Rob 2.0 -- the people were Rachel, Mitch, Miloh, Jake, Leila, Mike. He seemed like he wanted to be here, but he had a hard time accepting that he had to change. It's not clear which way he has to go.

Winn: here is another sort of really faulty psychological person. He's had a hard life. He can win you over. He can be disruptive. Everyplace I go, I can tell where he's been.

Rubin felt it was inappropriate to talk about Rob 2.0 without him being here to defend himself.

Danny felt that a warning was more appropriate than throwing things out.

Rachel Hospodar says that throwing stuff out like this without warning, is an asshole move.

Evan says we have a reasonable expectation that the rack was not being used, and ignored for a good period of time, and yes, it should be thrown out. A post to the main mailing list about that, though, would be useful.

Last night at 3AM, Rachel says we had a giant argument with Rob 2.0. We tried to convince him not to be an asshole. And then Rob's response was to explain the reasoning behind that behaviour. I don't care the reason behind it, I just care that he was an asshole, says Rachel, and now I feel I'm having the same experience with you, Rubin.

It was harder to pursuade him to change his behaviour, because we had to explain why Rubin is an asshole too, and why that's sometimes okay.

Someone says they hate Rubin. Someone says they love Rubin.

Wish was a newcomer, and was made to feel not welcome, and then left, and then came back. There have been territorial games, where if I fell asleep, people say they were going to put stuff out on the street. You can take it a step further with bullshit. It can go with people who have been longer, and play it as a negative aspect. You dont' want a whole lot of game-playing. Being excellent isn't quoting being excellent. Let's just try to be excellent. We shouldn't have insider intrigues.

Duncan can see both sides of it. Rachel made a good summation: one thing I will point out, a discussion with Danny, when I first got here, I was rather feral. The music went up, and I thought it was an excellent thing to pull the wire out, and I sort of modelled that on behaviour that I'd seen in the space. One thing to do: it might be mindful, with a broad spectrum of backgrounds, our behaviour will be modelled. It might be one thing to throw away a rack. Someone might do the same with a makerbot. While there's no hard and fast boundary, giving some error or doubt would be useful.

Someone notes that Rob 2.0 did leave the space voluntarily. He should get credit for that.

Jorgen believes he may have ADD. He'll take the scooter, and be five minutes in the workshop, he'll take out eight screws, and then he'll wander off onto the computer. The thing that bothered me was the constant usage of community computers.

One of the problems with Rob, is that he was sleeping here. Kayla says she has keys for a place for him to sleep.

If you see Rob taking things apart, ask him if he is going to put things back together.

Duncan says part of the issue is that he's got a rough history as a blackhat.

Rubin: nothing wrong with being a blackhat.

Duncan: but I think he wants to change, and all of this didn't help.

Someone: As a fellow person with ADHD, part of it is you don't consider the consequences of your actions. Executive functions aren't the greatest. You just have to form habits by restructuring things. Pretty much I think the best solution just to reiterate to Rob, to not do certain things, if you see him doing them.

Jorgen says he responds well with a good sense of humor.

Everyone agreed Jorgen is a good point person to have as the contact person.

We agreed to let Rob 2.0 help himself to the racks in the back classroom.

[edit] End of Meeting

  • PGP Key Signing could happen now, check the list to see who wants in on the action.
  • Put back the membership binder in the black desk.
  • Save the meeting notes to the wiki.
  • Send a copy of the meeting notes to the discussion list.
  • Copy the Meeting Notes Template for next week's agenda and update the main wiki page's link to it.
  • Enjoy a cocktail with your fellow hacker or robot.
Personal tools