[Noisebridge-discuss] Thought crimes at Noisebridge, and how can we stop them?

jim jim at systemateka.com
Thu Dec 19 22:09:38 UTC 2013


Nicely courteous, my thanks. 



On Thu, 2013-12-19 at 14:00 -0800, Madelynn Martiniere wrote:
> This makes very good sense, Jim. Johnny and Al expressed similar
> concerns, and I'm inclined to agree. I retract my suggestion about a
> separate list.
> 
> Cheers,
> Madelynn
> > 
> > jim
> > December 19, 2013 1:45 PM
> > I believe I've got the gist right, retry: 
> > 
> > For people to participate in the list they 
> > must join it explicitly. 
> > For various reasons ("I don't care", "I'll 
> > get around to it later", "I'm not joining those 
> > fascists"...) many people will not join a 
> > specific list, hence the discussions will be 
> > among people who are interested at the time the 
> > list is announced. 
> > Note that one person's interest does not 
> > necessarily map well to everyone's interest. 
> > The tendency of list subscribers will be to 
> > develop a direction with respect to the personal 
> > views of the list subscribers. The result will 
> > likely be a policy proposal that has matured 
> > without benefit of dissent. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > jim
> > December 19, 2013 12:46 PM
> > 
> > This idea has come up in times past and 
> > not taken hold. The objection seems to be 
> > that a separate list ghetto-izes such 
> > discussions away from the general community. 
> > It's a pain to suffer through long 
> > discussions about which one is disinterested, 
> > and the remedy is to inspect the Subject: 
> > headings and ignore some. 
> > The benefit to keeping such discussions 
> > on the general discuss list is that everyone 
> > has access to the discussions, and any impetus 
> > developed by a limited group is immediately 
> > subject to inspection. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > jim
> > December 19, 2013 12:04 PM
> > (My recollection is) originally we 
> > had declared that we must remember that 
> > members may participate in various, all 
> > valid, means: The Tuesday Night Meeting, 
> > IRC, various mailman lists.... 
> > Managing these (and other) media is 
> > too great a job for any one person (and 
> > thanks for trying!). 
> > My take was to have faith in others 
> > and don't try to fix problems--let the 
> > group dynamics take their courses and 
> > hope for the best (and get active with 
> > respect to things that impinge directly). 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> > Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> > https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> > 
> > 
> > Madelynn Martiniere
> > December 18, 2013 7:41 PM
> > Trying to find community is a thought crime? My bad, I didn't
> > realize the opinion of people who care about the future of the space
> > were so criminal.
> > 
> > Considering this statement in your previous email: 
> > And let's be honest, Noisebridge in the last two years (or even from
> > the
> > beginning) hasn't been the best establishment to go flaunt around
> > saying
> > you're a member of. It's sort of like telling all your friends
> > you're a
> > paying member of the festering techno trash dump and care home for
> > the
> > socially dongz, while mice and rats run around inside your sports
> > blazer.
> > 
> > Are you saying that it's not worth fixing because it's so messed up?
> > Because if so, then you're in no position to tell other people not
> > to try. If you're that sick and tired of hearing other people try to
> > fix a broken system, then I would suggest the alternative of just
> > not participating in any discussion about the space. Just hack some
> > things, and leave the rest of us to find productive solutions.
> > 
> > Cheers,
> > Madelynn
> >  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Rubin Abdi
> > December 18, 2013 6:37 PM
> > I'm getting sick and tired of people thinking they can fix
> > Noisebridge.
> > How can we put an end to this issue?
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> > Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> > https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Madelynn Martiniere
> Community Engineer. Entrepreneur. Geek.
> 
> LinkedIn | Twitter | Email
> 
> 
>  
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