[Noisebridge-discuss] Problem: people seeing NB as a backup shelter

Jeffrey Carl Faden jeffreyatw at gmail.com
Fri May 9 20:10:25 UTC 2014


This thread is taking a worrying turn toward "wishful thinking" and away
from "doing".


On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 1:08 PM, Naomi Most <pnaomi at gmail.com> wrote:

> That sounds like fun.  (With one major "but", below.)
>
> I'd be concerned about its fragility as a component in security
> infrastructure -- it will have power needs and maybe some other
> maintenance issues -- but I don't see any reason why we couldn't play
> around with something like that and install it when we're convinced
> that it works.
>
> BUT... a key entry system that requires foot-mobility would greatly
> reduce the accessibilty of our space.  We do have members in
> wheelchairs and members who regularly sprain their ankles.  :)
>
> So if we did this fun thing, it would have to be "in addition to" the
> keypad -- not a replacement for it.
>
> --Naomi
>
>
> On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 1:00 PM, Oren Beck <orenbeck at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Do we even need a "keypad" as such?
> >
> > I wonder... as a wild hare rabbit stew level idea- a camera aimed at
> numbers
> > projected on floor.  Block beam to # with foot in sequence= camera shows
> the
> > sequence to some AI realm program.  sort of how traffic lights use a
> camera
> > for  lane occupied detection.
> >
> >  I'd even consider- crude Machine CV scripts? Idea is: to begin timer
> loops
> > when a foot blocks beam ...
> >
> >
> > Place foot on light dot of #1= camera "sees" that as a button push.  Soft
> > tone to ack the press. Repeat per digits till done.  Wrong codes might
> start
> > a delay penalty timer... and/or "who's at the door" chime in the space???
> >
> >
> >
> >  If you know the code and how to step it in - After a few seconds of
> footsie
> > the relay clicks and you're in.
> >
> >
> >
> > There's a million details to get a usable build of my hack.  But the
> basic
> > concept is my gift to NB... I rather hope that some folks can show their
> > best efforts at this.
> >
> > I'd dare presume to assign person's X to some sub-task but that would be
> > cheating..  My
> >
> > Oren Beck
> >
> > 816.632.3695
> >
> >
> > On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 2:27 PM, Naomi Most <pnaomi at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> I'm merely suggesting that someone who has the expertise and enjoys
> >> the activity should probably be given the opportunity to step up and
> >> do a fun thing.
> >>
> >> --Naomi
> >>
> >>
> >> On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 12:03 PM, daravinne <daravinne at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > it doesn't matter if you *like* installing keypads.  you install a
> >> > keypad
> >> > because you feel strongly that it needs to be done. half the reason
> >> > we're at
> >> > the point we're at is because people only want to do what they like
> and
> >> > not
> >> > what needs to be done regardless of if they like it, and not enough
> >> > people
> >> > support the idea that we all have to do shit we don't necessarily find
> >> > to be
> >> > all rainbows and unicorns to make the space work the best for everyone
> >> > involved.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 11:53 AM, Naomi Most <pnaomi at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> Yep, makes sense to me.
> >> >>
> >> >> Let's do that.  Who's around who likes installing keypads?
> >> >>
> >> >> On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 11:51 AM, daravinne <daravinne at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >> >> > that was my initial suggestion when i floated the idea of putting
> in
> >> >> > a
> >> >> > keypad.  another key part of that idea was putting the keypad at
> the
> >> >> > TOP
> >> >> > OF
> >> >> > THE STAIRS (not outside the gate).
> >> >> >
> >> >> > let me repeat that: the keypad needs to go AT THE TOP OF THE
> STAIRS.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > of course everyone who ran with the idea put the stupid thing
> outside
> >> >> > the
> >> >> > gate, and it was a dumb idea and i had to disinvolve myself because
> >> >> > they
> >> >> > were fucking it up.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > the reason it needs to go at the top of the stairs is so it will
> not
> >> >> > affect
> >> >> > access to the rest of the building (let's not forget we are not the
> >> >> > only
> >> >> > tenants who use that downstairs gate) and it will allow people to
> >> >> > look
> >> >> > through the porthole and see who is even there in the first place.
> >> >> > it
> >> >> > would
> >> >> > probably be relatively trivial to just move the current keypad to
> the
> >> >> > top of
> >> >> > the stairs and set up a timed lock mechanism.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 11:46 AM, Naomi Most <pnaomi at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> A very cool suggestion was made at the SecWG meeting two Thursdays
> >> >> >> ago
> >> >> >> (next meeting this Thursday at 7pm!)
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> The idea was to install a physical two-factor auth system, where
> the
> >> >> >> key still works, but between certain certain hours (or some other
> >> >> >> heuristic) there's a keypad that must be entered to allow the key
> to
> >> >> >> actually open the door.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> --Naomi
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 11:43 AM, daravinne <daravinne at gmail.com>
> >> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> >> > other people use the building besides us.
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > changing the lock would also halt the worldwide outreach that
> >> >> >> > Mitch
> >> >> >> > and
> >> >> >> > others do by giving hackers and hackerspaces in other countries
> >> >> >> > copies
> >> >> >> > of
> >> >> >> > the noisebridge key by rendering that keypattern obsolete.
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > the solution is a combination of access control, improved
> >> >> >> > ownership
> >> >> >> > of
> >> >> >> > redshirts team, and outreach within the space that guides people
> >> >> >> > who
> >> >> >> > are
> >> >> >> > using it as a crashpad / alternate shelter to other resources
> >> >> >> > (which
> >> >> >> > simultaneously gets them out of the space and messages that the
> >> >> >> > space
> >> >> >> > is
> >> >> >> > definitely NOT a crashpad).
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > Since we are currently way past Dunbar's number AND mired in the
> >> >> >> > Tragedy
> >> >> >> > of
> >> >> >> > the Commons, it will take some fairly special, admirable and
> >> >> >> > dedicated
> >> >> >> > people to take ownership of these problems and see them through
> to
> >> >> >> > resolution (you know, sticking with it past all the
> >> >> >> > initial-failure
> >> >> >> > and
> >> >> >> > solving/tweaking mode stuff).
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 7:48 PM, Hannah Grimm <
> dharlette at gmail.com>
> >> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> I think that the solution here is access control to the space.
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> That starts with changing the lock, but I suspect that lots of
> >> >> >> >> folks
> >> >> >> >> would
> >> >> >> >> be opposed to that.
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 10:04 AM, Naomi Most <pnaomi at gmail.com>
> >> >> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> Johny reported:
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> "I met a woman who informed me that she could not get a bed
> at a
> >> >> >> >>> shelter, so she came to Noisebridge."
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> #0: is this a problem?  [yes, but is it a problem Noisebridge
> >> >> >> >>> can
> >> >> >> >>> fix?]
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> #1: What should we do to prevent this?
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> #2: If it can't be prevented, how should we address it when it
> >> >> >> >>> arises?
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> --
> >> >> >> >>> Naomi Theora Most
> >> >> >> >>> naomi at nthmost.com
> >> >> >> >>> +1-415-728-7490
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> skype: nthmost
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> http://twitter.com/nthmost
> >> >> >> >>> _______________________________________________
> >> >> >> >>> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> >> >> >> >>> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> >> >> >> >>>
> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________
> >> >> >> >> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> >> >> >> >> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> >> >> >> >>
> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> --
> >> >> >> Naomi Theora Most
> >> >> >> naomi at nthmost.com
> >> >> >> +1-415-728-7490
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> skype: nthmost
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> http://twitter.com/nthmost
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >> Naomi Theora Most
> >> >> naomi at nthmost.com
> >> >> +1-415-728-7490
> >> >>
> >> >> skype: nthmost
> >> >>
> >> >> http://twitter.com/nthmost
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Naomi Theora Most
> >> naomi at nthmost.com
> >> +1-415-728-7490
> >>
> >> skype: nthmost
> >>
> >> http://twitter.com/nthmost
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> >> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> >> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Naomi Theora Most
> naomi at nthmost.com
> +1-415-728-7490
>
> skype: nthmost
>
> http://twitter.com/nthmost
> _______________________________________________
> Noisebridge-discuss mailing list
> Noisebridge-discuss at lists.noisebridge.net
> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/noisebridge-discuss
>
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