[Tastebridge] lactobacilli fermented soda recipe

Nevada M. bramble.greenbrier at gmail.com
Thu Nov 10 13:23:46 PST 2011


Yeah, I guess that's a good point....  I definitely haven't tested the soda
to positively identify the bacteria present, but it is definitely not
(significantly) alcoholic, so it would probably be better just to call it
probiotic soda.


N



On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 12:32 PM, Frantisek Apfelbeck <algoldor at yahoo.com>wrote:

> Hi Nevada and all,
> Nice, nice, nice! I went quickly through the manual and I added some
> comments/suggestions here below. I'm tired after the work (hard manual
> labor :-(() so it is not very extensive.
>
> I just would to point out how sure are you if these are lactobacillus
> species which are present? If you leave the culture start in the wild
> manner, as you describe in the manual, it would be hard to actually
> say/predict what cultures are going to "colonize" and possibly gain
> dominance in the brew (if not identified experimentally). I know that
> Sandor Katz likes this approach a lot for his ferments, he generally
> stresses the "wild origin" of the brew underlining that multiple organisms
> may be involved. It may be good idea to alter the name a bit so it doesn't
> refer to lactobacilli specifically to avoid confusion because these species
> may be and may be not present (you talk about that a bit in the basics,
> concerning the molds etc.). Maybe something like "probiotic soda recipe"
> etc. (it may not be probiotic if "wrong culture" take hold but it may be
> more forgiving name). Anyway that would be my suggestion from point of view
> of nomenclature.
>
> I also would like to point out that you can go up to 11% (w/v) of honey
> without worrying about the disturbance of fermentation/life cycle of
> various probiotic organisms. I've been experimenting with this for several
> years (in Tastebridge too) and the final flavor of this drink with or
> without additional flavors made completely based on honey as sole sugar
> source was excellent! Once you dilute honey sufficiently (the dilution
> would probably differ for various organisms) the organisms can use it as
> source of energy quite fine (mead has even up to 1:3 honey to water
> dilution sometimes). More about that is actually just few lines below your
> recipe on the same webpage from our previous experiments (and I've just
> found out that there is "suboptimal" concentration on one place in the
> recipe (5% (w/v) instead of 8-11% (w/v), corrected :-)).
>
>
> https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Honey_Cooler_drink_manual_-_short_workshop_form
>
> Bit another point of view from our experiments in Ireland which focused
> especially on "honey cooler"/probiotic soda
>
> https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Ginger_ale_recipe
>
> Best of luck with the ferments, I'm really glad that you post it so there
> is another approach on the wikies.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Frantisek
>
> PS I would love to do some more research on the "bottling" step. The need
> to cool/hibernate the cultures is very limiting in some cases (large,
> generally expensive equipment needed) and if one wants to keep some
> sweetness in the drinks it is kind of necessity (bit difference in taste).
> I'd like to do some experiments where among the other sugar sources the
> prebiotic oligosaccharides could be used to feed the culture. These have
> level of sweetness up to 40% of saccharose (or more/less more
> research/reading needed) and are used as energy source by "some" probiotic
> organisms but not by all. If the culture was developed where various
> organisms would be present in a stable "symbiotic" environment which would
> however not be able to ferment given oligosaccharide, than a brew which
> would be nice and sweat and probiotic would be produced without the need of
> refrigeration - that is the theory. One single organism could be used
> instead but the negative effect because of intake of large quantities could
> take place concerning the probiotic flora of the intestinal tract.  Anyway
> that is the future, now my "haircut" and bed, I'm working tomorrow.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prebiotic_%28nutrition%29
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2011 23:38:14 -0800
> From: "Nevada M." <bramble.greenbrier at gmail.com>
> Subject: [Bio] lactobacilli fermented soda recipe
> To: bio at lists.noisebridge.net, Tastebridge
>     <tastebridge at lists.noisebridge.net>
> Message-ID:
>     <CAJz_BgZ5OcGP7egfDnMc2nd76nFr_MpvrGG13nKPeHjJ1xojzA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hey folks,
>
> I finally got around to posting the lactobacilli fermented soda recipe I
> have -- it's a way to make your own sweet, carbonated, probiotic sodas.
> I've made some delicious ones before; I thought it might be another
> project that could go along with the kombucha-making.  The link to the
> recipe's on this page:
> https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Recipes_and_Manuals
>
> Best,
>
>
> Nevada
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