[Tastebridge] Tastebridge Digest, Vol 32, Issue 3

Richard Conroy richard.conroy at gmail.com
Thu Mar 7 15:04:29 UTC 2013


Technically your ginger beer plant's alcohol strength is based on the
tolerance of the strongest yeast strain within it. So you could conceivably
hit good wine strengths.

I think though, that at the higher end of the ABV levels, it might make
your culture a bit unviable.

All this talk of ginger beer makes me think that I should start a culture.
Ginger is cheap here. If you are not making beer with it, you can bake
bread too.


On Thu, Mar 7, 2013 at 9:41 AM, Frantisek Apfelbeck <algoldor at yahoo.com>wrote:

> Beautiful! I had a just a meeting which part was proposal for building
> a small pilot fermentation facility. Now I'm coming back home and I'm
> looking forward to have more questions and talk about your and others
> experiments in next few days. I did not know that the ginger beer plant
> makes alcohol at such a concentration, my one was very low on ethanol.
> Concerning tamarind, amazing, I really love it for flavouring, the rest I
> will comment and talk about later on.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Frantisek Algoldor Apfelbeck
>
> PS I am very slowly working on a project of experimental incubator one of
> the purposes is to make soy beans based ferments like tempeh, miso, nato
> etc.
> biotechnologist&kvasir and hacker
>
>
> http://www.frantisekapfelbeck.org
>
>
> "There is no way to peace, peace is the way." Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi
>
>   *From:* Lewis Scaife <lewis.scaife at gmail.com>
> *To:* Frantisek Apfelbeck <algoldor at yahoo.com>
> *Cc:* "tastebridge at lists.noisebridge.net" <
> tastebridge at lists.noisebridge.net>
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 7, 2013 2:02 PM
> *Subject:* Re: Tastebridge Digest, Vol 32, Issue 3
>
>  hey, Frantisek and all - nice to read about your brewing escapades.
>
> surprisingly, the ginger beer plant product was more alcoholic than most
> beer, by my very scientific "estimation of inebriation." i purchased my
> plant from the source you reference (judging by the price) and enjoyed
> working with it - though it is more labor intensive than kombucha. my plant
> never really grew - possibly because my room temperature is too cool. i am
> considering building a larger incubator - i have a small one for tempeh and
> lactic acid ferments.
>
> the beer was great. i made a couple varieties - plain old ginger, galangal
> + kefir lime leaf and thai chili, and an apple cider beer. they were all
> delicious but i had unpredictable success with carbonation.
>
> the most recent of my competing interests has been flavoring kombucha
> vinegar. i'm making tamarind, galangal, ginger, thai chili, lemongrass,
> star anise, mint, and thai basil.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 5:15 PM, Frantisek Apfelbeck <algoldor at yahoo.com>wrote:
>
>  Hi Lewis&all,
> Sounds really nice, I was thinking about getting this culture already but
> did not because of high cost (I could kind of efford it, but I do not agree
> with the high price from my point of view - more than 20 or 25 EU for
> starting culture).
>
> The ginger beer which you made based on ginger beer plant is mostly
> non alcoholic right? I do non alcoholic ginger beers based on kombucha,
> water kefir and milk kefir whey, I like especially ones from dark brown
> sugar, of course if I can effort I love honey base ...
>
> Anyway please let me know how is it with the alcohol content based on
> ginger beer plant flavour and many thanks for tip!
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Frantisek Algoldor Apfelbeck
>
> PS I was "house sitting" the ginger beer plant culture for a friend in
> Seoul for three weeks and one of the batches which I done was really
> beautiful, one of the most tasty ferments which I have done till now ...
>
> biotechnologist&kvasir and hacker
>
>
> http://www.frantisekapfelbeck.org/
>
>
> "There is no way to peace, peace is the way." Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi
>
>   *From:* "tastebridge-request at lists.noisebridge.net" <
> tastebridge-request at lists.noisebridge.net>
> *To:* tastebridge at lists.noisebridge.net
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 7, 2013 6:41 AM
> *Subject:* Tastebridge Digest, Vol 32, Issue 3
>
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> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. Re: suggestions for alcoholic ginger beer experiments
>       (Lewis Scaife)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 13:40:48 -0800
> From: Lewis Scaife <lewis.scaife at gmail.com>
> Cc: tastebridge tastebridge <tastebridge at lists.noisebridge.net>
> Subject: Re: [Tastebridge] suggestions for alcoholic ginger beer
>     experiments
> Message-ID:
>     <CAOaAozZ5UpdrzRdRnb3dMVMBJDgvdCPsze4Zhv9a67W_Hg2yRw at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> regarding ginger beer, i spent much of 2012 making gb using an authentic gb
> plant.
> highly recommended over yeasted versions.
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 4:24 AM, Richard Conroy <richard.conroy at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Hi Frantisek,
> >    I have done quite a lot of alcoholic ferments using ginger, and
> started
> > out much the same as the way you did. I have since moved on to making my
> > ginger beer with malt extract/all grain, and hopping it just like any
> other
> > beer.
> >
> > Also using honey rather than refined sugar is another trick that I really
> > like, I use it for honey ginger wines where I want to have a higher
> alcohol
> > strength beverage (~8-10% ABV). Ginger + Honey + Red soft fruits &
> berries
> > (especially plums) = AWESOME.
> >
> > Standard advice with alcoholic ferments is to ferment until complete and
> > resweeten/prime when the yeast is done. The higher the strength, the
> longer
> > you will need to leave it age and develop flavour, but they also preserve
> > longer. You will need a hydrometer/refractometer. If you bottle too early
> > you can get some interesting bottle bombs.
> >
> > Many of the components of ginger, including its fieryness are in my
> > experience very volatile, and blow out your airlock when you do alcoholic
> > ferments.
> >
> > I am thinking of trying to introduce more of it at batch priming time
> > instead (but I dont do batch priming currently). The theory is that you
> add
> > your priming sugar into a solution, and siphon your ferment onto it.
> Leave
> > until it fully mixes and then bottle with that. Your priming solution can
> > contain more than just water, and you can use it to introduce flavour
> kicks
> > or volatile aromas lost during fermentation. Haven't tested this yet.
> >
> > I have haphazardly taken down odd notes and photos here:
> > https://www.facebook.com/The.Sum.of.all.Beers
> >
> > Been meaning to store this in somewhere more ordered, but life is a bit
> > too busy at the moment.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 8:14 AM, Frantisek Apfelbeck <algoldor at yahoo.com
> >wrote:
> >
> >> Hi Michael,
> >> Many thanks for tips! I will get back to your email most likely
> tomorrow.
> >> Just for now I've relocated to South Korea, specifically to the island
> >> called Jeju. Beautiful location but I have not found a brewing shop here
> >> yet so I have to be minimalistic.
> >>
> >> Anyway talk to you more tomorrow and once more thanks for your tips.
> >>
> >> Sincerely,
> >>
> >> Frantisek Algoldor Apfelbeck
> >>
> >> biotechnologist&kvasir and hacker
> >>
> >>
> >> http://www.frantisekapfelbeck.org/
>
> >>
> >>
> >> "There is no way to peace, peace is the way." Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi
> >>
> >>  ------------------------------
> >> *From:* Michael Lyons <cprmichael at yahoo.com>
> >> *To:* Frantisek Apfelbeck <algoldor at yahoo.com>
> >> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 5, 2013 3:46 PM
> >> *Subject:* Re: [Tastebridge] suggestions for alcoholic ginger beer
> >> experiments
> >>
> >> Thanks for asking. I've have quite a bit of experience brewing though
> >> hardly consider myself to be an expert. I applaud you for brewing an
> >> alcoholic drink that is not beer. Personally, I stopped brewing beer a
> few
> >> years ago when the price of ingredients doubled and it became cost
> >> prohibitive for me.
> >>
> >> First of all, there are many reasons to not use baking yeast, and many
> >> types of yeast to choose from which have different qualities  you can
> take
> >> advantage of. One of these qualities is the alcohol concentration at
> which
> >> the yeast attenuates ie. stops functioning. Another quality  is how well
> >> the dead yeast flocculate and settle out of the liquid.
> >>
> >> Another substance you might want to consider is Yeast Nutrient, which is
> >> inexpensive. I have used it when I have brewed hard cider, which doesn't
> >> have the natural nutrients that beer wort does.
> >> The quantity of yeast you use is not particularly relevant since the
> >> yeasties multiply and theoretically one yeast cell could (eventually)
> >> ferment any amount of beverage. Asking at brew shop is a good idea.
> >> Also keep in mind that yeast are reusable, so you can save some of the
> >> used yeast in a suitable, airlocked bottle. A really fun thing to do is
> >> to have a fresh batch ready for ferment when you siphon off the finished
> >> brew off the old yeast. Dump the fresh batch on top of the old yeast
> and it
> >> will take off full bore in an couple of hours.
> >>
> >> As for adjusting the sweetness, I suggest using a non-fermenting
> >> sweetener, like stevia or lactose. I remember having a problem with a
> cider
> >> I made that would not stop fermenting. I had let it ferment until the
> yeast
> >> stopped, but it ended up tasting incredibly dry. When I added more
> sugar to
> >> get the right  sweetness, the yeast would re-activate and within a week
> or
> >> two the sugar would be gone and the cider would be too dry again.
> >>
> >> If you are using brown sugar for flavor, remember that it is white sugar
> >> mixed with molasses, and you might as well use white sugar and add
> molasses
> >> for flavor.
> >>
> >> Speaking of flavorings, it is often best to add them after the
> >> fermentation. When I tried making a cherry cider, all of my great cherry
> >> flavor I'd added before fermenting went up in the bubbles my yeast gave
> >> off while it was working on the sugar during fermentation.
> >>
> >> As for water, remember that Anchor brewery and I think speakeasy too,
> use
> >> straight SF tap water. Fine product from Hetch Hetchy. Great taste and
> fine
> >> to brew with. Chlorine & flouride and inconsequential no need to filter,
> >> sanitize or mess with the water from the tap; "they" already do that.
> >>
> >> As for fermentation vessels, most people I know use either 5 gallon food
> >> grade plastic buckets with lids or glass carboys.  Fermentation locks
> are
> >> necessary to keep out bacteria and  errant yeast, especially during the
> >> later stages of the fermentation when the yeast is not throwing off so
> much
> >> CO2. Many of us rig up a blow off tube for the first part of the
> >> fermentation because ordinary locks can get clogged with vigorously
> >> bubbling yeast and blow out..
> >> Fyi, we have all this gear at Noisebridge.
> >>
> >> I have no idea what temperature 25C is, but the nice thing about living
> >> where we do is that yeast like it too. 60-70F. I would be leery of
> using a
> >> submersible pump, since the brew is not circulating  and you're likely
> to
> >> get part of the batch too hot. Traditionally we keep blankets around the
> >>  brewing vessel and they make electrically heated wraps for fermentation
> >> containers.
> >>
> >> Well that's my two cents. Good luck and let me know if you have any more
> >> questions or would like any other help.
> >>
> >> -michaeLyons
> >>
> >>  ------------------------------
> >> *From:* Frantisek Apfelbeck <algoldor at yahoo.com>
> >> *To:* "foodhackingbase at lists.hackerspaces.org" <
> >> foodhackingbase at lists.hackerspaces.org>; tastebridge tastebridge <
> >> tastebridge at lists.noisebridge.net>; 091 Foods <
> 091-food at googlegroups.com>
> >>
> >> *Sent:* Monday, March 4, 2013 5:06 PM
> >> *Subject:* [Tastebridge] suggestions for alcoholic ginger beer
> >> experiments
> >>
> >> Hi to all and to alcoholic brewers especially,
> >> I just started a new experiment aiming to brew nice alcoholic ginger
> beer
> >> and I have some questions below. My first batch will be most likely too
> >> sweet,  but it is the max end of the screening which I want to do (on
> the
> >> sweet side), the details for the first experiment are below. I would
> like
> >> to ask for recommendations for the next experiments, I put some ideas
> below
> >> at the end. It is possible that I may be able to sell the final
> product, of
> >> course I plan to share the technology, recopies etc.
> >>
> >> The final volume of the brew = 5 l; Specifications:
> >>
> >> 0.1% (w/v; 5 g) of bakers dried instant yeast (primed/activated in warm
> >> water with bit of light brown sugar for +-30 min)
> >> 20% (w/v; 1000 g) of light brown sugar (dissolved in hot water)
> >> 4%(w/v; 200 g) of ginger (fresh, cleaned by brush and blended in mixer,
> >> added to the brew at the beginning of fermentation)
> >> 95% of used water is commercial purified water (I shake it a bit to get
> >> some oxygen in it)
> >> fermentation vessel is 5 l plastic container, narrow mouth, closed by
> >> lid, no air lock at the momment
> >> the brew is fermenting at +-25C in my "aquarium heater" based incubator
> >>
> >> It started to go on within few hours and it is fermenting really
> >> strongly, anaerobic fermentation as mentioned. I tasted it yesterday
> (two
> >> days after starting) and it is quite sweet still and bit alcoholic. I am
> >> thinking about starting another brews under same conditions changing
> just
> >> the sugar concentration to 15% and 10%(w/v). What do you think about
> that?
> >> Below are more ideas, please do remember that I do not have too much
> >> experience with alcoholic fermentations. Also I ferment in the same
> >> environment all my probiotics but I am using the clean newly bought
> plastic
> >> vessels for the alcoholic ginger beer.
> >>
> >> THE NEXT EXPERIMENTS - Ideas and suggestions
> >> - decreasing the level of sugar concentrations to 10 and 15% (w/v; 500
> >> and 750 g respectively)
> >> - changing the type of sugar for completely white sugar (which may be an
> >> issue concerning the nutrition for the yeast) resulting in more clear
> >> gingery flavour
> >> -  changing the type of sugar for dark rich brown sugar resulting in
> >> more heavy complex flavour because of molasses
> >> - changing the amount of yeast added to a lower concentration
> >> to decrease the possibly off flavour
> >> - increasing the concentration of ginger and maybe processing it with
> >> heat, which would result in more "spicy flavour" due to the
> transformation
> >> of gingerol to more pungent zingerone
> >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gingerol
> >> - more ideas?
> >>
> >> I should mention that I do not have access to any specific yeast now,
> I'm
> >> bit low on cash, otherwise what strains would you recommend? I heard
> nice
> >> thinks about California Ale yeast but I'm not sure if it would be
> suitable.
> >> Maybe some more "cider" style yeast would be better?
> >>
> >> Many thanks for any ideas, I will be in touch within next few days with
> >> few news :-)
> >>
> >> Sincerely,
> >>
> >> FAA
> >>
> >> PS I have made another batch of kimchi yesterday from Chinese cabbage,
> >> miso, fish souse, ginger and garlic so I'm really looking forward for
> the
> >> results.
> >>
> >> Frantisek Algoldor Apfelbeck
> >>
> >> biotechnologist&kvasir and hacker
> >>
> >>
> >> http://www.frantisekapfelbeck.org/
>
> >>
> >>
> >> "There is no way to peace, peace is the way." Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Tastebridge mailing list
> >> Tastebridge at lists.noisebridge.net
> >> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/tastebridge
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Tastebridge mailing list
> >> Tastebridge at lists.noisebridge.net
> >> https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/tastebridge
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > http://richardconroy.blogspot.com/ | http://twitter.com/RichardConroy
>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > https://www.noisebridge.net/mailman/listinfo/tastebridge
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