Meeting Notes 2014 06 24

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These are the notes from the The 319th Meeting of Noisebridge. Note-taker: John Shutt; Moderator: Corey.

  • Item changing official access policy to, "Noisebridge should be as open as possible," is consensed. Responsibility for various aspects of the Great Noisebridge Reboot of 2014 was assigned to interested parties.

Short announcements and events[edit]

  • Sunday, June 29th: Polyglotte is having a launch party for its multilingual keyboard, built by Noisebridgers!

Membership Binder [edit]

  • Daniel Lewis, not dated or signed. No sponsors. Naomi recognizes his name as a volunteer from The Internet.
  • Qbit, 12+ weeks. One sponsor. Overdue. Application will be pulled and Qbit will need to reapply.
  • Jarrod Hicks, designer and maker, present. Casey and Monad are sponsors. Week 3.
  • Xavier Mendoza. 4+ weeks, not present. One sponsor, Kevin. Wants to work on narrative structure engines.
  • Tristan Mosely, not signed or dated.
  • John Ellis, not present, known applicant but his membership application is missing. Has two sponsors. No action on this until John E. is present and we find out what happened to his application sheet.

Financial Report[edit]

  • None given. Please fill in if you know how much money we have.

Consensus items[edit]

Proposals from last week [edit]

Date               Proposed by Wording Decision Author of this Record
2014-06-24 Dan F What was consensed as
 Noisebridge's space shall be open only to members and associate members
 at any time. A member or associate member may at any time invite a person
 into Noisebridge and host that person at Noisebridge as long as that
 member or associate member remains at Noisebridge. No other person shall
 be permitted at Noisebridge at any other time.

should be changed to

 Noisebridge should be "as open as possible" ...
Consensed John Shutt

Proposals for next week [edit]

(Add any new items for consensus to the Current Consensus Items page.)

Discussion Notes[edit]

[We begin with discussion of the reboot.]

Naomi: Great to have 30-40 volunteers on the sheet. This might not be a ridiculous pipedream. David Fine proposed an accountability/responsibility system.

Shannon: For every task there is a set of roles. Someone whose job it is to make sure task gets done, others whose job(s) it is to actually do it, another who is the owner of the task, another to sign off, and others who give input.

Naomi: We don't need to follow too closely, but I think it's a good concept. Would allow people to contribute where they can, for example, Jim could take the lead on the flooring but can't physically do the flooring. Recruiting "vessels" whose roles it is to move large equipment around. We need to make actual plans. We have a rough idea of when we're doing things, but we need a more specific idea. If we're awesome, we can make it so everyone's working a little bit less than they otherwise would be. Those are the overarching concepts.

Casey: R.A.C.I.

Naomi: We can see if anyone wants to be on point. We need to buy things and coordinate work. The "responsible" person is responsible for making sure it actually happens, but will have various helpers. [Goes into an example scenario involving flooring.]

Casey: Do we need to pick the accountable person for each individual task?

Forrest: Agreed we will use RACI model? How to split it up by task?

Naomi: Will depend on the task.

Forrest: We don't need to pick people tonight, just figure out high-level questions.

Shannon: We don't have to pick somebody for every task, just the responsible person.

Naomi: If we have to go through and nail down everything that's required today, we will fail. We should break out into groups. I just got here and I'm hungry.

Casey: Flooring, garbage, networking area...

Jarrod: I think it's a good idea to put the trash area behind the kitchen.

Shannon: Is there someone who's got the responsible role for the entire project?

Naomi: No one named but...basically me.

Matt: [Arrives.] The back room (behind kitchen) needs drywall, and we can't put stuff in front of the water heater. This makes putting trash back there an issue.

Naomi: Who wants to be in charge of garbage?

Matt: I can drywall it.

Naomi: Great, you're responsible for garbage.

Casey: We need to figure out the tasks.

Daravinne: [Goes to look for a whiteboard.] I'll do A/V stuff.

Casey: I'll do networking and access control.

Naomi: [Has calendars, Rice Krispy Treats.]

[General milling around.]

[Whiteboard logistics and so forth.]

[Jarrod has electrical work blueprints.]

Jarrod: This is the scope of what the electricians are doing in the space.

Naomi: We have to decide in this meeting what to do with the member shelving area. There's a subpanel back there.

Casey: There is jack shit connected to the subpanel.

Naomi: There is no reason to have the member shelves over there.

Matt: I'd like to open it up for audio-visual stuff.

Naomi: Getting rid of the member shelves is the thing to do at this point. We have to give instructions to the electricians.

Kevin: [Is here.] Should we leave the subpanel not hooked up?

Casey: It's hooked up right now.

Kevin: We should give the least amount of work possible to the electricians.

Corey: Replace member shelves permanently?

Casey: Yeah, they're full of random shit, maintenance hassle, several shelves belong to people on different continents.

Naomi: I advise everybody to get on the Build mailing list.

Mike: How does one get on the mailing list?

Naomi: Go to the wiki, look for "build", subscribe. Slack is ephemeral and good for snark. I am the responsible party for the rebuild. My job is to give away responsibilities. I am going to do one or two grunt jobs. Do not come to me looking for decisions on various things.

Daravinne: As the person standing in front of the whiteboard, I think we should break tasks down and assign to people.

Naomi: Reboot sheet is chronology-based.

Casey: The sheet is not divided into seperate categories. [Pulls up reboot master plan.] Just a timeline. Signage, access control, trash...

Casey: temporary rehoming (laser cutter, soldering irons, etc.), floors, electrical, paint, A/V, networking...

Kevin: Does trash encompass e-waste?

Casey: Trash is a big category. Trash is everything.

Alda: There's trash-trash, e-waste, scrap metal...

Daravinne: Incidental single-time trash, re-occuring weekly trash, trash infrastructure.

Casey: Thinking about the clean-out.

Naomi: Two projects: Rehoming trash cans, ongoing trash removal.

Alda: [Points out e-waste number.]

Casey: Trash purge.

Naomi: That will happen as consequence of other projects.

Corey: Let's talk signage.

Matt: We have the vinyl cutter going for signage to be ready for closing.

Daravinne: Signage is not trivial.

[Matt is the responsible party.]

Daravinne: The next step is prioritizing the tasks.

Naomi: That's a strange way to go about it, because some things have to happen before other things.

Daravinne: So they are a higher priority.

Forrest: Are we thinking about the elevator and other stuff? Easier to do major layout stuff after trash is gone.

Mux: We talked about lockers.

[Daravinne adds lockers/member shelves to whiteboard.]

Naomi: We have to decide, minimum, on layout of member shelves corner.

Daravinne: We can schedule a dedicated planning session. We should do that in a non-weekly-meeting context.

Matt: Can we agree on opening space and taking down the wall?

X: [Is here.] I'm willing to take over handling claims and sorting of member shelves stuff.

Matt: Assign whether stuff is hackable.

Naomi: I'd like to assign David Fine to that. He will be ruthless about getting rid of things.

X: We can use someone to sort e-waste and make a pile of stuff that is or is not hackable.

Daravinne: It would be nice if David Fine were here. Tell him to get his ass in here at some point.

Alda: Trash keeps coming back in by the DJ booth.

Daravinne: The DJ booth is getting ripped out.

Alda: It would make a good sewing area.

Casey: Can we delegate this?

Alda: There needs to be a better policy about people who leave things here on an extended basis.

Naomi: We are going to talk about policy in the second half of July. We don't have a plan yet.

Matt: There is a policy in place. If it's out, it's hackable.

Naomi: No one wants to hack a pile of dirty sheets.

Kevin: I sympathize with David Fine, would like to help with deciding what stays and what goes.

Casey: I'll take care of access control.

Naomi: The first two weeks will be all about dump runs.

Daravinne: [Wants to hear from David Fine before assigning him to trash stuff.] This list is for responsible parties.

Naomi: We mixed up accountable and responsible parties.

Daravinne: We can just make a list of interested people and decide roles later.

Corey: Let's skip trash for now.

Casey: Laser cutter, 3D printer, plotter, most of the soldering irons, all need to go.

Shannon: I'm happy to take that project on. Question: How do we feel about taking everything out of the space?

Daravinne: Where would we put it?

Shannon: If we take it out and don't bring it back, is it worth having?

Casey: Do you want to ask electricians their exact opinions?

Naomi: There was a suggestion of a storage unit before.

Jarrod: Electricians are coming in on Thursday and Friday. I can do a walkthrough with them and make a list.

Casey: If you want to store everything, no one will stop you.

Naomi: We do have to clear off the floors.

Mux: Basement?

Daravinne: Not allowed down there.

Mux: But as a storage unit?

Shannon: We should get threads going on the build list for each of these tasks.

Naomi: Yeah.

Corey: Floors?

Naomi: Jim accountable, I'm responsible. I'm going to need a few other volunteers who have endurance.

Mux: And a lot of tolerance for solvents.

Corey: Electrical?

Naomi: The electricians are accountable and responsible. They will take on whoever they feel like, but don't need help. They need people who can paint and carpent and clean.

Daravinne: Paint?

Casey: Painting conduits, painting walls.

Mux: Paint before the floors?

Naomi: Floors can wait til third week of July. Important part is timing correctly.

Alda: What if exterminator says floor needs to come up?

Naomi: What exterminator? If landlord doesn't want to do it he doesn't want to do it.

Alda: I can smell mice in the Turing room.

Naomi: We'll do what we can, but if we don't treat the whole building it's worthless.

Matt: We're above a produce store.

Naomi: Source of food for ten generations.

Casey: I propose to buy networking in phases. I could use a responsible party for the first phase, doing macro physical stuff. Chris Devers wanted to be responsible for physical stuff.

Naomi: Really?

Casey: I don't know if I have the ability to coordinate everything.

Naomi: Jonathan Lasoff came forward to help. Chris and I can help. No reason to go out of house.

Casey: I take responsiblity.

Daravinne: I'll put you and crw down.

Casey: I assume that we have to drop the rack.

Kevin: [Withdraws name from trash responsibility, volunteers as free agent.]

Daravinne: This is a stub. We'll ultimately transfer this to the wiki and mailing list and fill it out. Not everyone interested is necessarily here.

Naomi: True. We need to add the hidey-holes to the board.

Daravinne: You mean the everywhere?

Naomi: We need a group to reduce the number of hidey-holes. Including people good at carpentry.

Corey: Do we need a thing for kitchen stuff?

Hicks: Dirty shop is mine.

Daravinne: We can figure out dishes, what to do with the stove. We shouldn't have too much storage space or it will accumulate a bunch of stuff. Minimize it, don't rip it out.

Naomi: We could use a kitchen tyrant.

Vi: [Is here.] I'll do it.

Matt: Between Vi and Jean-Jacques...

Vi: Add me and Jean-Jacques for recurring trash.

Daravinne: Spacebridge? Andy says he's on it. Their shelves have to be handled with care. People should be contacted and stuff.

Casey: [Thinks this a good list.]

Naomi: We're missing the thing about carpenting over hidey-holes.

Shannon: Plumbers?

Daravinne: Layout meeting.

Naomi: [Agrees] Let's call it layout. I am pro the general concept of making it so people can't sleep under the DJ booth.

Casey: Only sleeping on top of the DJ booth.

Daravinne: I especially care about this because the layout and A/V thing are interlinked.

J: I have a truck and packing stuff if you need it.

Naomi: We want to get all contact info on the riseup sheet.

[Adrian Chadd arrives, volunteers to help with networking. Daravinne writes his name on the board.]

Naomi: This board is not for everybody, only the sexy people1.

Adrian: I volunteer for something, and this is how you treat me?

[Adrian volunteers for access control, also. Name goes on the board there too.]

Naomi: No, stop! You don't know what's happening!

Daravinne: So what?

Naomi: We're going with the concept of [rehash of the RACI system]. We're not putting everybody here, just naming accountable parties.

[Daravinne finds jellybeans.]

Naomi: The more people who are listed as Accountable, the less useful the chart will be.

Corey: Next step is the riseup thing?

Naomi: I need to have the info on there first. People should sign up to the build list. Who here does not have a computer?

Casey: Internet is all fucked up right now. We'll fix this in the reboot.

[Matt adds stuff to the wiki.]

Naomi + Adrian + Daravinne: We should schedule the layout meeting right away.

[Logistics. Adrian points out it's Pride Weekend. General griping that Pride Weekend has gone downhill.]

Corey: Please feel free to give us your e-mail if you're volunteering for things.

[Someone brought Dos Equis but isn't sharing. The notetaker can see the bottles piling up on the other side of the table.]

Naomi: Our two options are put lockers against the wall where member shelves are, or find something that needs power from the subpanel.

Daravinne: Layout meeting will be a long-ass meeting.

Naomi: We need to make the member shelf area decision before Thursday.

Casey: Let's use all these excited people and tear down the member shelves right now.

X: We have shitloads of boxes with shit in them. We could dump the shit out and have little boxes to put shit in from member shelves.

Daravinne: Let's consense on this.

Jarrod: Should we close the meeting and start tearing things down?

Corey: We still need to do members and discussion items.

Naomi: Just for the sake of volunteer coordination and avoidance of boredom, here's an announcement, then we'll take a break, then we'll come back to this. Sign up to build mailing list, add contact info to the riseup pad, copy your name down into each section you would help with.

Corey: Let's take a five-minute break.

[Break begins. Rustling noises from boxes of shit being dug through.]

Corey: Let's start the meeting again. We'll do layout discussion post-meeting. Let's talk membership. Any other discussions?

Mux: We have a line on lockers, but it runs out in a couple days.

Matt: I think that guy got called by four of us.

Mux: 60 one-foot square lockers with clear doors and 60 more with opaque doors. We can get it all for less than $600.

Daravinne: Clear ones would be useful for small things. Small opaque ones may be less useful.

Mux: Tie locker use to membership?

Daravinne: Stuff on the member shelves are wildly variant in size.

Matt: We need a few lockers for bigger stuff. Lasers and so forth. But let's get small lockers to begin with.

Daravinne: I can throw money at this problem.

Mux: We can stagger lockers nicely for more space.

Naomi: I'm hoping for a large variety of lockers for projects. For example, 5 Minutes of Fame locker. [Hooray!]

Adrian: The other thing to keep in mind is: look how big the storage space of the member shelves is, and how much of that space isn't actually used.

Shannon: People leave stuff there because they can.

Adrian: Having smaller lockers means less stuff can accumulate.

Alda: Along with new lockers, we need better record-keeping. There's selective enforcement of who can stay and who can go. We need to have a system for whose locker is whose.

Naomi: The point is we lose the deal in two days. Can we raise money?

[Naomi, Mux, Henner, John, Julio, Adrian, Forrest, Alda, and possibly others throw down cash for clear lockers.]

Kevin: I don't think it's a great idea to charge for lockers going forward. I think it sets a bad expectation of security.

Corey: But that's already on the wiki: Just access, not security.

Naomi: We need record-keeping for lockers.

X: Al hasn't talked to anybody about existing lockers in months.

Mux: This might be something we can solve with software. Let's talk about locker purchase on Slack tomorrow.

Corey: Moving forward, anything else urgent?

Vi: What happened to the red phone? Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

Naomi: Let's add that to a list of special projects and see if anybody wants to pick these up.

X: The phone was piggy-backed on our DSL account. Really crappily wired by some half-assed hacker, not even duct taped together. If it works at all, I'd be impressed. If we add it to the networking plan, if we lay a few voice lines...

Adrian: I can add free switching to that.

Corey: Moving on to membership.

[Kevin explains membership. "This is not like a chess club or gymnasium. It is a commitment to governance and participation in the consensus process." Kevin thinks this is a weird meeting, like, structurally. Julio explains associate membership. Jarrod explains consensus. Sparks fly out of a power strip on the other side of the room.]

Corey: Daniel Lewis, not dated or signed. Qbit, from February.

Naomi: It's over 12 weeks.

X: It's overdue.

Corey: He only has one sponsor.

Vi: He has to reapply?

Naomi: Yes.

Corey: Jarrod Hicks, designer and maker. Casey and Monad as sponsors. He's in week three. Xavier Mendoza. 4+ weeks. One sponsor, Kevin. Wants to work on narrative structure engines and contribute more as a member. Tristan Mosely, not signed or dated. Skipping this one. John Ellis' membership application is missing. He had two sponsors.

X: Is there anyone present at 4+ weeks with two sponsors?

Corey: No.

Naomi: Giving John Ellis the benefit of the doubt. Not sure why his sheet isn't in there.

Vi: I noticed there's a surveillance camera by member shelves and another in the hallway.

Matt: Neither are active. I pulled off the cover and didn't see any wiring. 98% sure it isn't hooked up.

Vi: Why are they there?

Matt: Maybe a deterrent?

Vi: I feel like I'm living in a surveillance state.

[Clumping and bumping around in the member shelf area.]

Kevin: What about consensus items?

Corey: This is the one about access policy wording. Current wording is [long description of associate membership and stuff]. What is being consensed is that, "Noisebridge should be as open as possible."

Casey: I'm not going to block it, but I don't like the consensus proposal very much. I like the consensus proposal from before. The current policy, I think, is the right answer. I'm going to stand aside, but I'm not going to block it.

Corey: There is also on the table that this stuff may change during the reboot.

Kevin: I feel it's a great way to move into a reboot, and the balance that it brings that we are "as open as possible." More in line with the current practice of attending Noisebridge. I feel it is an important step.

Casey: No specific concerns, but this doesn't feel very actionable.

Jarrod: In a way it is actionable, because it brings our policy in line with what actually happens in the space. If this gets consensed, it is being acted upon.

Casey: Okay, that makes sense. [Goes searching for a tool that's missing.]

Greg: [Heard Noisebridge is open to everyone at any time, but wonders why policy changed in the first place.]

Forrest: One thing I've always wondered re: the whole anarchy thing, there's no list of things that are specifically excellent or unexcellent. There are no conditions of excellence like don't sleep here or burn the space down. It seems there's an eternal battle that everyone can come but there are no ground rules.

Naomi: The core issue is that people who come here and don't wish to become inculturated don't care what the rules are. Whatever you write down will only be paid attention to by people who care about rules in the first place. No written policy has affected people doing meth in the bathrooms and things like that.

Adrian: The access policy didn't make the space any less closed. It only added a very blunt object to ask people to leave.

Shannon: People who are inculturated to Noisebridge are *also* committed to not following the rules.

Mux: There's a lot more to the rules. Should we also throw away anti-harassment policy?

Adrian: That was a specific response to many issues that we've seen.

Matt: An anti-harassment policy is good to have in place. It's just common sense. The other rules about access to the space, I think that falls back to the anarchist principle that this place was defined by in the beginning. Anarchy is not no-government, it's self-governance. Having sex on top of the lockers is *usually* unexcellent.

[General agreement that in certain cases sex on top of the lockers may be excellent.]

Casey: I have a question for Dan. I'm coming around to changing my mind. As the person who is the most responsible adult at night here...

X: Just for the record, Evil Dan at Noisebridge is currently being considered the most responsible adult.

Casey: Of the people here, you have probably done the most enforcement of the access policy in terms of sheer number of incidents. You're proposing this item, so I know the answer, but I'm asking anyway: Has the existing policy affected how you enforced the access policy?

Dan: The existing policy has, since it first started, caused me personally some anxiety, and the same has been expressed by other people. When it was restricted hours, I stayed away at night. But then I saw what was actually going on in the early morning, that people were not being quizzed on their sponsors and et cetera. It has led to a few conversations where people said that because I wasn't a member they wouldn't listen to me. It hasn't made a material difference lately, but it is personally kind of demoralizing and confusing to me. What's important is having a working access control policy. I'd like to see more experimentation and a working web of trust. If you look at what the rules are, nobody actually enforces them. It's more about getting bad actors out -- excess control, not access control. It would be a morale booster to see a clean slate. Less confusion and less anxiety.

Vi: If you don't feel safe here because someone is harassing you, the question to ask is if this person is on some kind of controlled substance. If it's someone who usually isn't like that, give them a chance to clean up their act. Better to ask people to take a break from Noisebridge rather than ban.

Corey: Do you have any comments on the wording being proposed?

Vi: Open access doesn't mean people can do whatever they want. They can be asked to leave, but should be asked to leave nicely.

Matt: It says it right on the board as you enter the space that you should act appropriately. Problems have always been dealt with internally. Simple wording reflects that.

Naomi: To address a bit of what Vi is saying, we need to step up our game re: understanding people and talking to people and knowing their names, and we have to get the community working group and safe-space working group actually functioning. We should start meeting about these in late July. Meditate on these while doing physical labor, like Zen monks. As we renew the physical space we can renew our spiritual space as well.

Bill: [Arrives.] I am Bill. Bill Hill. I randomly come in here. I agree it is good to know people's names. People who are members are listed somewhere...

Julio: No, they're not.

Bill: Well that's too bad. We should have a guest book. If you are afraid to have your name known to the rest of people, what are you doing here?

X: I am X. *The* X. I think this current wording is a step in the right direction.

Corey: No blocks. This item is consensed.

Dan: Quick announcement. We need people for the safe-space working group. It's not really a safe group to be in. We deal with high-conflict situations and individuals. It's also potentially a bit of a power trip, so we'll be attracting people who like to get into each other's business. One of the biggest issues we're going to face is dealing with high turnover. That's going to be a feature, not a bug. I've been doing meetings for about a month and ready to step back. It's a fractal group: Any time there are people in the space or online who care about safe space. It's about feeling psychologically safe here. Some overlap with security, but also about harassment and bullying.

Corey: It's Tuesday at 5:30pm?

Dan: Maybe. If it's too early, other people can schedule times that work better. It's not meant to be a star chamber, but it could become that if you don't get involved yourself.

X: Announcement: Sudo Room is moving into the Omni, 45th and Shattuck. Everyone should visit.

Corey: Meeting closed.


  • Jarrod - Designer and likes to work in the wood shop.
  • Nora - First time here, thinks the reboot would be a good chance to help out.
  • Drew - Goes by mux, likes really large clouds and electronic music.
  • Forrest - Lurker mostly, but Mitch asked for volunteers and good at lifting, holding, and smashing.
  • J - Sysadmin, has been around for a few weeks.
  • Greg - Intern at SFSU this summer, likes 3D printing, wants to start a hackerspace in Austin.
  • Alan - Likes software, robots, photography.
  • Gerald - Is eating Flavor Twists, visual merchandiser, came from LA.
  • Mike - Drinks Java in morning, does Java throughout the day, does JavaScript in the evening.
  • Shannon - Works with computers.
  • Casey - Has been coming around since 2010, likes drilling holes into things and GPG.
  • John - Taking notes.
  • Evan - Came to Circuit Hacking Mondays, thought space was cool, wants to volunteer for reboot.
  • Alda - Interested in magic square quilts.
  • Daravinne - Has just been given a floorplan of Noisebridge.
  • Corey - Here to write and run the meeting.
  • Naomi - Is hungry.
  • Adrian
  • Kevin
  • Matt
  • X
  • Vi
  • Bill
  • Dan
  • Jade