Meeting Notes 2023 10 17

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These are the notes from the The 744th Meeting of Noisebridge.

Date: 2023_10_17

Edit the meeting number above where it says the XXXth meeting of Noisebridge (by checking previous meetings)


Previous Meeting

Next Meeting

Note-takers: boredzo

Moderators: Cloud

  • One or two bullet points of high-level meeting summary.

Meeting Summary[edit | edit source]


  • Fundraising Update:
  • Announcements:
  • Finances:
  • New members:
  • New associates:
  • Consensus Items:
  • Discussion Items:

Introductions[edit | edit source]

  • Ask people to share their name, access needs, and preferred gender pronouns what they do at noisebridge
  • Cloud: 5MOF, persuasive design
  • Jack: Sewing, origami, applying to be Associate Member
  • Sean: Laser cutter, 5 mof contributer
  • Mark: Lurking in the shadows
  • Tony: hacks
  • Ying: product designer
  • Wim: reads programming books, plays arcade games
  • Collin: uses the laser to make drawer organizers
  • Ben: Ben. Here often, downstairs at CNC machine designin and cuttin
  • Peter (they/them): takin notes currently
  • Andrew: Woodshop
  • Sam: CNC stuff, Unreal Engine, Hack the Box
  • TJ: AI/Robots (will be back in November!)

Short announcements and events[edit | edit source]

Maker fair part 2 this weeeeekend (in case anyone wants to sign up for makerfaire this weekend) link drop

Lockpicking event with TOOOL Possible dates: Dec 17, Mar 17, June 16, or Sep 15? 5-20 people Planning on Reserving upstairs front area for it

Hack the Box Season started three weeks ago No in-person date yet; Discord channel to come

Excellence[edit | edit source]

Our One Rule is to Be Excellent to Each Other. (On first Tuesdays, seek a few definitions. Other Tuesday, give a 1-3 sentence summary.)

Being excellent means having respect for the space and the people and things in it. Don't take things that don't belong to you. Don't touch people without their consent. If you didn't bring it in, don't bring it out. Doing due diligence before doing anything. And having a fun time YEAH!

What does that mean? Please see our page on excellence!

Anti-Harassment Policy & Community Standards of Excellence[edit | edit source]

Noisebridge has an Anti-Harassment Policy Everyone is expected to follow the Anti-Harassment Policy, please familiarize yourself with it.) TWO MINUTES MAX More approachable & specific guidelines,

Brief Kudos[edit | edit source]

Recent examples of excellent behavior, say 3, unless the passion moves you.

Guilds[edit | edit source]

  • What are guilds - briefly describe (much like the previous section on "Excellence")
  • Sewing Guild needs new people to be responsible for it since its previous leaders have stepped down.
  • Game develpoment class has moved to Thursdays @ 6PM!

New Members/Associate Members[edit | edit source]

What are they? Is anyone trying to become a Member or Associate Member? If not move on. No long discussions.

Jack for Associate Member, sponsored by Emiline[edit | edit source]

  • Doesn't have a project idea yet
  • May be willing to run the Sewing Guild

Jack becomes an Associate Member!

Wyatt for Associate Member, sponsored by Sam[edit | edit source]

  • Has a CAD background; wants to do CNC and work on video games
  • Has helped with clean-up
  • Help maintain the music area; work on the door/access system
  • Has three cats

Wyatt becomes an Associate Member!

Financial Report (first Tuesday of month only)[edit | edit source]

Anarchist societies under a capitalist state need money to survive and thrive, yo.

September Donations: 6975.65 Expenses: 16,832.01

Incidental expenses that account for the high expenses total 2k on permits, 1700 on shipping of industrial knitting machine, 2k on club mate

Spending Needs[edit | edit source]

Gotta spend money on XYZ (i.e. Gate, wiring etc.). WHO CAN SIGN THE CHECK OR LEND THE CREDIT CARD!?!?! It doesn't matter if we agree to do something and it can’t be paid for.

pyconaut might order some business cards.

Fundraising Update[edit | edit source]

How's it all going

Probably sold a bunch of club mate at Maker Faire Might sell more if ppl from MF come visit during this week

Currently soliciting fundraiser ideas. Please pitch something!

Big C Consensus Items[edit | edit source]

Nobody likes 3 hour meetings, only explain if people ask.

Consensus Items [edit | edit source]

Only for talking about Big C consensus items, small c consensus items should be discussed with people at the space at the time of the change/new item.

Discussion[edit | edit source]

Maker Faire[edit | edit source]

  • TJ: What was the main takeway?
  • Barakados: Lots of interest in the quilt, made with the knitting machine, as well as the CNC projects.

Signs with QR codes leading to the website would be nice to help ppl get information more quickly and easily.

  • Did we have any flyers?
  • We had some flyers, printed signs.
  • boredzo saw something on Slack about needing more business cards?
  • QR codes, stickers
  • Where is the volunteer sign-up?
  • Pinned in the #maker-faire channel in discord (under 'events' subsection)
  • Mark: gonna pester Ryan and Corey to see what the plan is for this weekend. Keep an eye out in the #maker-faire channel of Discord
  • TJ: Can we print out a big "Noisebridge banner"
  • Mark: Do you want to take resposibility for that?
  • TJ: [Does not have time] (Wants to focus on robot demo and related stuff)
  • Who has access to the list of people who have signed up?
  • pyconaut.

Discussion Item 2[edit | edit source]

Internet - switch to comcast - for reliability.

  • Sam mentioned this : do people agree we have issues
  • TJ has seen occasional slow speeds for some casual usages on Monkeybrains. Also, we don't have IPv6. Unclear how much that's needed - maybe for Hack the Box, and OpenVPN had trouble because IPv6 was disabled.
  • Loren will look into it. Comcast might be twice as much money.
  • TJ: Satellite has caused connectivity problems.
  • Loren: That'll get worse when the rains come.

Discussion Item 3[edit | edit source]

"shrinkage" of downstairs sewing machine. 86/ban conditional on return. Ask to leave / stay away for some time. Shek. Other ongoing conflicts in use of sewing machine, lying about training, breaking machines.

boredzo notes that the machine is back, but this doesn't resolve broader issues.

Mark questions whether we can get anything done on this subject with none of the involved persons present.

The sewing machine is returned.

TJ: After discussing it with people today, it sounded like there was some small-c consensus to have the machine taken away, but this was a miscommunication with the Sewing Guild. Loren: To my understanding, the response to ask Ken or Emiline was not followed. Loren: The meetings set the norms that people follow. These discussions need to happen at a meeting. boredzo: There are still some raw feelings on this, so that might be why folks are not here tonight. Could try asking folks to come next week to talk about this. Loren: Sam and shek might oppose an 86. We could ask shek to leave for a month to take a breath on this issue, but we also need to do something about this. TJ: Is this a matter of punishing shek or is this a matter where the people responsible let it happen? Mark: I think it's reasonable for someone to take a leave of absence and it not be considered a punishment. Loren: We could ask shek, what would he like to be the standard here? In a month. TJ: We need to get the story. It might be easier to have this discussion - there are people who are willing to take responsibility for it who are established members of the space, and it might be less inflammatory for them to be that side of mediation rather shek himself. Loren: It doesn't make sense to assume the best intent. Loren: We take some action which is ask to leave for a month. I don't know what else to do. Loren: This should happen in public. It should be clear how we resolve this. This is both about the specific issue and how we solve this in general. It sucks that we're going through all the stress, but this stress represents how much we want to maintain the space and the community and to have nice things. TJ: Membership has a lot of control in what happens. We need to discuss it as- the mediation should be between the Membership. The greater problem seems to be a complaint with how Noisebridge is in general run. 1. There is a nontrivial amount of work that some folks do including interpersonal discussions, but that doesn't mean that there isn't accountability to be had. There should be a broader discussion among Membership. This sounds like a broader issue than just 86ing a single person. If an ask-to-leave is what's required to get people to the table, then maybe that's necessary. Loren: If you want to seriously consider some other way of running the space, I'm open to proposals. "We should have a big discussion" is a good way to not have anything happen. TJ: The specific proposal is there's currently a conflict as to what actually happen. What happened with the stealing of the sewing machine? I was not aware that people actually let this person "borrow" the sewing machine, and they're willing to say that. Do we just tell people not to do that in the future? Do we ask Sam to leave for doing that? Will we do ask-to-leave for everyone who takes accountability for it? Tony: Then the lesson leaves with the person. Loren: Ask-to-leave is temporary. TJ, can you raise the strong and simple version of what you're proposing? TJ / strong proposal, as requested by Loren: If people are upset with how the space is wrong, such that we're asking people to leave, then the people who are running the space should be accountable. I don't have enough info on the specifics of what happened, but one side would probably say ask-to-leave for everyone accountable and then talk afterward; the other side would say let's talk about how to prevent this from happening in the future. I'm speaking on behalf of people and making a lot of assumptions if I say anything more than that. Mark: We have to be able to easily determine who is responsible and to what degree. TJ: If we're ATLing a single person and they asked someone else for permission, should that person also be punished? Cloud: You want Sam to be held accountable because he let shek in and shek stole the machine? Mark: Who's accountable if this was done by small-c consensus? [Discussion of "do not remove" labels having been removed from the machine] Mark: I'm not saying this was the right move, just that it's a reasonable explanation other than intentional stealing. Cloud: From what I'd heard, shek thought he was under the impression that it was OK to borrow it. Mark: Unfortunately now we're getting into the specifics and we don't know which reality was real. Mark: The people in charge of the sewing guild have left. It's not up for discussion for them. Loren: It's the fifth or sixth straw for them. This was about lots of things. TJ: The question is, what do we want to do? We would be more productive if we had some suggestions for people running the space of ways to improve running the space. It was a small-c consensus, so putting it on one person (Sam) just because "I talked to them [and they said it was OK]" is unfair. TJ: It seems like you are implying less-than-fair intentions of Emeline and other members of the space. It sounds like you believe that they are not willing to listen to you. Mark: They're not willing to listen to anyone. TJ: That is a conflict in itself. If they believe membership isn't willing to listen to each other. Mark: That's why I took a long break and stopped talking about it. TJ: That is a much bigger problem. Mark: We can work on productive things right now. We can work with them on passing the baton. We can be there ready to have the discussion when they're ready to talk about it. I'm not interested in waiting for that just to make Noisebridge better. Loren: I am requesting an ask-to-leave. Emeline asked for six months; I said one month. Ask to leave shek for one month. TJ: I feel uneasy about this, if the first step is asking someone to leave the space without knowing what exactly happened. Colin: How about a formal ask to mediation, both sides? Mark: Good luck. I'm not opposed to it; I believe it's always been pretty well established that the norm is, when asked to leave, you do it, regardless of whether you did anything unexcellent, whether you did anything wrong or not. It's excellent to respect the process and come back a better Noisebridger. TJ: If it's respectfully done. Mark: We're not telling shek he did anything wrong; we're asking him to leave for a little while. That's what we're asking for. TJ: If there's precedent for ATL as a means of cooling down conflict, then I'm OK with it. Loren: Any objections? Mark: I might propose we go farther but I don't know that I'm ready to do that yet. I think I need to have a talk with someone else first before I raise any alternative action.

No objections asking shek to leave for one month.

TJ: Should we do the same with anyone else tangentially involved? Mark: I want to talk to Sam about this and get his sense of what went down and his role in it. Cloud: Isn't it harsh to ask Sam to leave? Mark: It's not a punishment. It's just a cooling-off. If you asked me to leave for a month, I'd fuckin' leave for a month. It's important.

Andrew: I feel like if I was asked to leave, I'd come back a better Noisebridger.

Rahil: I lead a lot of tours. Should I be more forceful in saying "don't take the laser cutter". TJ: I would go so far as saying: Any use of machine managed by a guild, should be with the permission of the guild. Mark: example of using (and messing with innards of) the arcade machine.

Q: Are the names of guild leaders posted anywhere or is it just on the wiki? Loren: It's on the wiki. There are QR codes that go to the Guilds/Contact wiki page, which I'm aiming to do-ocratly build out.

Loren: As a compromise for now, do we want to ask Sam not to come to the next meeting? Mark: Ask him *not* to come? Cloud: I think the idea was to hold Sam accountable for letting shek in. Loren: Let's decide on a norm for what we'd want Sam to do going forward. Mark: Doesn't the fact that he has a stake constitute a reason to include him? Loren: I don't know. Loren: So, never mind. Mark: I would ask him if he'd like any of the names struck from the notes or not. Loren: This is very low-stakes conflict. TJ: There's no protecting from threats.

Do-ocratic Task Board[edit | edit source]

Participation also means doing stuff to contribute to the space. Propose new tasks or pick some tasks from Github, from what needs to be done around you, or whatever, and see if someone will sign up to work on that task. Anyone can sign up and it's a great way to show you are contributing!

End of Meeting[edit | edit source]

Note taker posts the notes[edit | edit source]

  • Clean and tidy the meeting notes including removing all these really verbose instructions.
  • Fill out the short summary at the top listing just announcements, consensus items, discussion topics, and names of new members and philanthropists.
  • Copy paste the notes to the next meeting page. (They will become Last meeting at midnight.)
  • Email the meeting summary to Noisebridge Discuss and Noisebridge Announce lists.
  • CC on the email and if there are new members and philanthropists.
  • Edit the Current Consensus Items if anything is proposed for consensus next week.
  • Edit the Consensus Items History if anything was reached consensus or failed to reach consensus this week.

Fun things to do after[edit | edit source]

  • Do a 10 minute cleanup, bring dishes up stairs and wash them, clean the bathroom
  • Have some beers on the patio
  • Prepare the next weeks' meeting notes
  • Lick the walls. Or just draw on them
  • sing the Hackernationale (this almost never happens)